Ho zaun asa Wiktionaricho Tintto! Hangasor akhea somudaien Wiktionary vixim bhasabhas korunk zata.
हो जावन आसा विक्शनरीचो तिंटो! हांगासर आख्या समुदायेन विक्शनरी विशीं भासाभास करुंक जाता।
Thanks for setting this up[बदल]
Why we need to be discussing here[बदल]
Over the past 2-3 days, some of us interested in setting up a Konkani Wiktionary have set up a small WhatsApp group, and have been discussing issue there. While WhatsApp might be a useful way to stay in touch, discuss while on the go, and brainstorm, as a fora it also has certain limitations. @The Discoverer has rightly pointed out in a WhatsApp post: "If we take any decision here [on WhatsApp], people from Wikimedia can't see that there has been a discussion process behind it. Secondly, they don't know how active the community is if we keep discussing here. So can we continue to have some informal chatter here [on WhatsApp], but let the Tinto be the mainstay, specially for important discussions?" Just sharing this point of view, and saying I agree with it fully. Guys, if you're serious about a Konkani Wiktionary, please come here often and post your comments. PS: Currently, there are 13 participants on the WhatsApp group, which was founded among those who showed an interest in such technical and Wiktionary-related issues -- Fr Luis, Isidore Dantas 1, The Discoverer, Ananth, Animesh, Darshan and me (Fredericknoronha). --Fredericknoronha (talk) 11:40, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Update of what was discussed[बदल]
This is a kind of summary (may not be comprehensive, or fully accurate) of what was discussed on the WhatsApp group so far:
- The focus of the group is to discuss Konkani Wiktionary issues. Only on-topic, only polite discussions pls:: @Fredericknoronha
- Some discussions on which platform could help -- Wiktionary, WordNet, WordWeb or Ding :: Multiple discussants
- Proposed to start with Konkani Wiktionary in the incubator. :: @The Discoverer
- Konkani Wiktionary Test wiki info page created by @The Discoverer :: http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wt/gom
- Darshan, Fr Luis, Isidore, Fredericknoronha and The Discoverer added as community members. And @Banduji.
- Simple main page created by @The Discoverer. https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wiktionary:Tinto
- Requirements to launch Wiktionary: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Language_proposal_policy :: @The Discoverer
- Please express your support here: https://meta.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wiktionary_Konkani
- MediaWiki core messages need translation: https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Manual
- At present, only 18% of Mediawiki-core is is translated into Konkani.
- Request to Isidore Dantas1 to help with http://translatewiki.net and Konkani there
- Specimen of a short entry:Antenatal
- Discussion over language use, whether English-to-Konkani entries okay.
- See examples from other Wiktionaries (for the layout of pages): Usually, the first is a definition of the word in the language of a particular Wiktionary, and below is the translation in other languages. I think sometimes they also have example sentences. They also give references. (Update: See below section regarding entry layout) --The Discoverer.
- Example of a Wiktionary page: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Konkani (with meanings, synonyms, etc)
- Let's get moving. If we have 10 volunteers offering to input 10 words a day, we could be on track. Then, the language experts could correct and improve those words. (I'm seeing an opportunity in copyright-expired dictionaries and Creative Common-ed dictionaries, like Isidore's.) At the same time, we can ask Isidore and others to translate the tech strings awaiting translation at the site mentioned above. ::Fredericknoronha
- Need to standardise page structure (entry layout). To avoid the need to rework later.
- Requirements for a Konkani Wiktionary listed here: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new-languages/Wiktionary_Konkani
- Suggested with start with smaller, do-able goals: 10 volunteers each pledging to do 10 words a day. Maybe an initial target of a basic, 3000-word Wiktionary.
- Need to have discussions on the Wiktionary Tinto (for openness, and record). See above.
- Statistics for the Konkani Wiktionary (under incubation) are as follows https://tools.wmflabs.org/meta/catanalysis/index.php?cat=0&title=wt/gom&wiki=incubatorwiki --Fredericknoronha (talk) 12:19, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Strot / Sources[बदल]
We are fortunate to have some free sources available for the Konkani Wiktionary. I have listed some sources that we can use at the following location: Wiktionary:Strot. Please go through them, make use of them and add any other sources that you know of. The Discoverer (talk) 12:39, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Name for the Konkani Wiktionary[बदल]
We have to select a name for the Konkani Wiktionary. Some options that I would throw in are: Wiktionary, Wikxonar, Wiki-utravoll, Wikixobdkox. Please give your opinions. The Discoverer (talk) 16:46, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Please go through the Entry Layout guide of the English Wiktionary and try to imbibe the main principles when creating entries in the Konkani Wiktionary. In particular see the section 'A very simple example' to understand the basics.
I suggest that as a bare minimum we use level 2 headings (two equal signs) to mark sections for each language we are giving the meaning in. Also, please place your entry either in Category:Konknni utram or Category:Inglez utram.
Feedback about the Konkani Wiktionary[बदल]
I had requested the Language Committee to evaluate the Konkani Wiktionary project, and we have received feedback from a member of the committee. You can read the conversation here.
The main points highlighted for improvement are as follows:
- Interface translation on TranslateWiki.net has to be done. I will try to coordinate with Isidore, Fr. Luis and others for this.
- For several entries, we have only provided translations from Konkani to English or English to Konkani. He says "the first purpose is not to be a Konkani-English or Konkani-Portuguese dictionary, but to be a Konkani dictionary." That means that for every entry, we have to write a small description in Konkani.
- Entries for non-Konkani words should contain a small description in Konkani, and a link to the Konkani word, but not much other content. Other related content should be on the entry for the Konkani word.
- At the moment, the number of pages in the Wiktionary is small.
- The proportion of Devanagari entries is small at the moment.
- We need to involve more contributors and grow the community. The member commented that: "Right now, this is mostly your show, and LangCom is reluctant to approve projects that seem like one-person creations."
- We will try to have one or more workshops for the Wiktionary in Goa in May; this could help us to address points 4, 5 and 6 above.
- We also need to try to improve the quality of our entries. For example, we should have references for our entries.
Whenever you create entries, please try to keep the above points in mind.
Wiktionary Workshop Held at St. Xavier's College[बदल]
Today ( 16 th May 2019) Wiktionary workshop was held at St. Xavier's College Mapusa Goa. The resource person for the workshop was The Discoverer. Special invitee for the workshop was Hariet for Mangalore. Altogether 9 persons attended the workshop.--Konknni mogi 24 (talk) 14:34, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
Konkani Wiktionary Excel form[बदल]
We have created a Microsoft Excel form that helps to easily generate entries for the Konkani Wiktionary with the proper Wiki-markup formatting. If you would like to have this file, please ask me or another of the regular contributors to the Konkani Wiktionary. The Discoverer (talk) 05:38, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
Wiktionary meeting held at St. Xavier's College, Mapusa[बदल]
A Konkani Wiktionary meet-up was held at St. Xavier's College, Mapusa, Goa at 4pm on 7 Dec 2019. All the members of the meta:Wikipedians of Goa User Group were invited via the WhatsApp group.
- The present status of the Konkani Wiktionary and Wikipedia were discussed.
- The continuous and ongoing contributions of Isidore Dantas1 on the Wiktionary and Darshan kandolkar on the Wikipedia were highlighted.
- One of the points that came out of this discussion was that the aim should be not just to get the Wiktionary approved, but rather to build a community of contributors so that the project will sustain in the long term.
- The attendees appreciated the work of new editors, especially SerTanmay on Goa-related topics on the English Wikipedia.
- The attendees agreed to try to each do 11 edits per month on the Wiktionary.
- The comments from the Wikimedia Language Committee review of the Wiktionary project in November 2019 were presented. The committee member had expressed satisfaction about the activity level but pointed out that we are lagging in the interface translation, which is also mandatory in order for the Wiktionary to be approved.
- Konknni mogi 24, Melissa Simoes and John Noronha volunteered to work on the interface translation. It was decided to start with the transliteration of the strings that are already available in Romi into Devanagari.
- The process of interface translation on translatewiki.net was demonstrated.
- Konknni mogi 24 highlighted the importance of reviewing the interface translation work by each other.
- In relation to the activity of translation of the software interface, the difficulties faced in translating computer terminology and the possibility of building a standard list of Konkani words for computer terms was discussed.
- The possibility of introducing Wiki editing into university and college curriculum was discussed, which could help in having more activity on the Wiktionary and Wikipedia.
- The working of the Wiktionary and the methods to create entries was demonstrated.
- It was suggested that the Konkani Wiktionary new entry Excel form could be improved by adding a field for the references.
- It was decided to try to hold the next meeting around 21-23 December. The attendees will work on creating entries and translating the interface in the meantime and then share their experiences in the next meeting.
Help page for interface translation[बदल]
We had an informal meet up at St. Xavier's College on the morning of 30 December 2019. Konknni mogi 24, John Noronha, Darshan kandolkar and The Discoverer were present. This was like a follow-up to the previous meeting held in December, and we mainly spent time clearing queries and discussing about creating entries in the Wiktionary, the entry layout, and doing interface translations in translatewiki.net .
We decided that going ahead, we will keep the section titles of the entries in both, Romi and Devanagari so that all the entries will be accessible to more people. Konknni mogi 24 suggested that we can add audio files to the entries.
We also resolved to work on interface message translations in Devanagari Konkani of the 'Mediawiki Core' message group. In order to facilitate this, a help page to explain the process has been created:
Do go through this page, and suggest improvements if required, or if any additional explanation is needed. I have added a link to this page on the Konkani Wiktionary main page.
- When we met at St. Xavier's College on 30 December, we had decided that we will keep the section titles in both, Romi and Devanagari. However, after further discussions with Isidore Dantas and Konknni mogi 24, we came to the conclusion that it is best to keep the section titles in only one script, and that will be the script of the page title. Accordingly, we have created a new Excel form. This form works just the same as the previous form, the only difference is that there are tabs at the top of the form where you can choose either Romi or Devanagari, and then the form saves the text with headings in the respective script. If you would like to have this file, please ask me or another of the regular contributors to the Konkani Wiktionary. The Discoverer (talk) 15:03, 21 February 2020 (UTC)
Site settings discussion[बदल]
Good news! The Wikimedia Language Committee has released a notification that they intend to approve the Konkani Wiktionary project.
Before the site can be created, we, the Konkani Wiktionary community need to discuss and decide on some site settings. Please visit this page and provide your feedback on the page: Wiktionary:Initial site settings discussion . The Discoverer (talk) 16:05, 30 March 2020 (UTC)
All content imported[बदल]
Hello, all Konkani Wiktionary contributors, and welcome to the newly-created Konkani Wiktionary! I have imported all content here from the Incubator now, so you can start contributing here now. Be aware that a few software things aren't totally in place yet, so for a few days the visual editor will not work, so you have to edit in source mode for now. As a new wiki importer I have certain administrator permissions temporarily, so if you need help with e.g. deleting pages or something, I can help with that. If there is something urgent, you can always ask in the #wikimedia-stewards channel on IRC. Do let me know if you have any questions or requests, and I'll try to help as best I can! Jon Harald Søby (उलयात) 16:40, 21 मे 2020 (IST)
- Thank you for your work, Jon Harald Søby :) . I took a quick look around, and I came across only one page that has been missed to import: incubator:Help:Wt/gom/Interface_translation.
- You mentioned that Visual Editor will not work, but at the moment that's the default editing mode, and it's working :D . The first thing I had to do was to go to preferences and enable the Wiktext Editor tab. Since most of us in the Konkani Wikipedia editing community usually use Wikitext Editing, would it be possible for you to change the settings for everyone so that both, the Visual Editor and WikiText Editor tabs are enabled by default? Thanks once again! The Discoverer (उलयात) 00:52, 22 मे 2020 (IST)
- @The Discoverer When I try to visually edit an existing page, the page is blank in visual editor. Are pages not blank for you? For creating new pages it should work, but for editing existing pages it will take some days before the content will appear.
- As for enabling both tabs, that is easy to fix in the software, but we need consensus first. Could you please create a section about it on this page? After about a week has passed and there is consensus, the change can be made.
- And the missing page has been imported now: आदार:Interface translation. Jon Harald Søby (उलयात) 21:57, 22 मे 2020 (IST)
- Thanks for importing the page, Jon Harald Søby. You are right, the pages are blank in Visual Editor.. I didn't notice that. I have created a section below asking for feedback regarding the request for both tabs.
- There was one odd thing I noticed, the main page has an interlanguage link (the link at the bottom in the sidebar) to aa.wiktionary.org . I haven't been able to figure out where that is coming from. Perhaps it will disappear once the database and all the Wikidata settings are sorted out?
- Regards, The Discoverer (uloi) 22:24, 22 मे 2020 (IST)
- Hello Jon Harald Søby, there are a few things that seem to be not working properly with regards to the Konkani Wiktionary. Could you please take a look?
- The main page has an interlanguage link (the link at the bottom in the sidebar) to aa.wiktionary.org .
- The page statistics are all zero.
- I now have temporary admin privileges on the Konkani Wiktionary, but when I go to Special:Import, it says that 'No wikis from which to import have been defined and direct history uploads are disabled.'
- The Discoverer (uloi) 12:55, 1 जून 2020 (IST)
- Hello Jon Harald Søby, there are a few things that seem to be not working properly with regards to the Konkani Wiktionary. Could you please take a look?
- Hi The Discoverer!
- The first issue is weird indeed, I don't know why that one link is there. All new wikis usually use the
aawiki as a template (so new Wikipedias use aa.wikipedia, new Wiktionaries use aa.wiktionary), but I don't know where the actual link is coming from – it doesn't seem to be in the source of the page nor in any Wikidata item. However, I'm fairly certain that this will resolve itself once Wikidata support is enabled (follow progress in Phabricator), which should happen some time next week unless something unforeseen happens.
- The second issue (Special:Statistics) seems to have resolved itself.
- The fifth issue is indeed because no import sources are defined. I suggest you start a new section here asking to be able to import from e.g. the Konkani Wikipedia, from Incubator, from the English Wiktionary or whichever wikis you feel a need to import from, then we can enable that in the settings once a consensus has been reached. As usual, please let me know if you need any help! :-) Jon Harald Søby (उलयात) 16:25, 1 जून 2020 (IST)
Thank you for your reply, Jon Harald Søby
- It's surprising that the Statistics page which was not working a few hours ago is working now.. perhaps it was waiting for you to visit it :)
- Regarding importing, I may be wrong, but on the Konkani Wikipedia, by default we were able to import from all the Wikimedia wikis. Nevertheless, I have opened a section below asking to be able to import from certain wikis.
- There is another issue that is not specific to the Konkani Wiktionary, but affects the Konkani Wiktionary as well:  . Do you have any idea why this is happening?
- Regarding my earlier request to enable both editing tabs for everyone, I think we can hold it for now, because the feedback from the community members is that once they switch to the Wikitext editing mode, from the next time onwards, they automatically go to Wikitext mode, so as it is a one-time thing, perhaps we don't need to enable both tabs for everyone.
- For importing it is common that only a few select wikis are chosen as potential import sources. You can see the import source configurations for various wikis here, under
- I replied to the rights log question where you asked it, so others who would see the question can see the answer as well. :-)
- 👍 for the editing tabs. Jon Harald Søby (उलयात) 18:37, 1 जून 2020 (IST)
- All Wikimedia wikis have their statistics reinitialized (recounted) twice a month, on the 1st and 15th. This wiki was just counted for the first time early in the morning of 1 June (between 05:00 and 06:00 UTC, if I'm not mistaken). - dcljr (उलयात) 06:10, 2 जून 2020 (IST)
- Hello Jon Harald Søby, it has been a week since I opened the section below about enabling imports from certain wikis. Could it be enabled now? Should I create a task in Phabricator? The Discoverer (uloi) 12:31, 8 जून 2020 (IST)
- Pinging Jon Harald Søby regarding enabling imports. The Discoverer (uloi) 19:12, 9 जून 2020 (IST)
- I have created a task in Phabricator for configuring the import sources. The Discoverer (uloi) 11:52, 11 जून 2020 (IST)
Request for temporary adminship[बदल]
I would like to request for temporary adminship for 6 months, including interface administrator access, in order to perform various housekeeping tasks and to set up and import templates necessary for this new wiki. Please mention your support / objections if any below. The Discoverer (उलयात) 19:02, 22 मे 2020 (IST)
Enabling both, Visual Editor and Wikitext editing tabs by default everyone[बदल]
On this new site, clicking on 'बदल' / 'Bodol' opens the Visual Editor by default. I have requested for both, the Visual Editor, and the Wikitext editor ('मूल बदल' / 'Mull bodol') tabs to be shown by everyone by default. Please give us your opinion on this.
Note that even if it is not enabled for everyone by default, you can change this setting at any time for yourself in the preferences (Posonteo -> Editing -> Editing mode , पसंत्यो -> संपादन -> सम्पादन तरीका).
For a few days, until everything is configured properly, the page will be blank while using the Visual Editor. In that case, you can switch to the Wikitext editor by clicking on the pencil icon in the upper right corner of the editing window and then selecting 'Source editing'. The Discoverer (uloi) 22:31, 22 मे 2020 (IST)
Requesting for deployment of new talk page tools on the Konkani Wiktionary[बदल]
We had discussed in the past about the different options available for discussion pages. I am requesting for new talk page tools (mainly the reply button) to be implemented in the Konkani Wiktionary. Please give your opinion / objections, if any, below. The Discoverer (uloi) 13:44, 23 मे 2020 (IST)
Requesting for ability to import pages, templates, etc.[बदल]
I wish to request permission to import pages, templates, etc. from other Wiktionaries / Wikis into the Konkani Wiktionary. Please give your opinion below. Following are the wikis from which I am requesting permission to import from:
- Konkani Wikipedia
- Wikimedia Incubator
- English Wikipedia
- English Wiktionary
- Portuguese Wiktionary
- French Wiktionary
- I have created a task in Phabricator for this. The Discoverer (uloi) 11:52, 11 जून 2020 (IST)
Removed section titles in both scripts[बदल]
We had decided to move to keeping the section headings in only one script. Accordingly, I have replaced all multi-script section headings in all entries with single-script headings using the tool AutoWikiBrowser (AWB). The Discoverer (uloi) 23:34, 19 जून 2020 (IST)
Alternative of ShortURL extension[बदल]
Hi, I am Jay Prakash from meta:Indic-TechCom. First of all congratulation on your new project. I have seen that this community requested for ShortURL extension. But it was declined by the developer. So Indic-TechCom developed an alternative of ShortURL. See meta:Indic-TechCom/Tools/ShortUrlLink. You can install this user script for a Short URL. If you need any technical regarding Extention/Gadget help then ping me. Thank you--Jayprakash12345 (उलयात) 00:31, 6 जुलय 2020 (IST)